Jeff Lyons was our guest for both Euro and USA chat.
Euro moderator: Teenie Russell
USA moderator: Zac Sanford and Jamie Livingston
EURO CHAT
2013-02-17 8:00 pm teenierussell It's #SCRIPTCHAT
O'CLOCK! Tonight we are joined by @Storygeeks
as we chat about Ideas Testing and Stories #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:00 pm Storygeeks Hello scriptchat-folks-in-Europe!
I'm here---so fire away n #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:00 pm TaroJ #scriptchat
Hi
2013-02-17 8:01 pm teenierussell You can
read Jeff's Bio here - http://t.co/FPBQW4wx #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:01 pm Storygeeks Great to
b here again ... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:01 pm teenierussell @Storygeeks Hi Jeff,
thank you for joining us! #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:01 pm teenierussell RT @Storygeeks:
Hello scriptchat-folks-in-Europe! Im here---so fire
away #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:02 pm Storygeeks FYI... I
have quite a lag on posts... :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:02 pm writingnewman #scriptchat
friends, here's a sketch written and directed by ya boy at
FvF. http://t.co/iIW5u22q
2013-02-17 8:03 pm Storygeeks I gave a
workshop yesterday... and asked the qeustion "what is a
story" #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:03 pm Storygeeks I got as
many responses as there were participants... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:03 pm Storygeeks how is
that possible? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:04 pm Storygeeks you'd
think a bunch of writers would have a consensus on this
question... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:04 pm Storygeeks NOT! #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:04 pm teenierussell @Storygeeks So,
ideas testing. I try to write loglines for ideas to see if
they are going anywhere. #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:04 pm tracinell Tonight's
#scriptchat! :) http://t.co/IwRTSXgc #screenwriting
2013-02-17 8:05 pm Storygeeks @teenierussel ... so
what do you mean by a log line :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:05 pm TaroJ @Storygeeks what was
your most surprising answer? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:05 pm vickyhinault Hi #scriptchat
!
2013-02-17 8:05 pm Storygeeks @teenierusell ... hwo
are you defining this term? I have a reason for
asking... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:06 pm teenierussell @vickyhinault Hi
Vicky! #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:06 pm Storygeeks @Taroj.... most
surprising was the long, blank stare...n #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:07 pm TaroJ @Storygeeks ha :-)
how would you answer what a story is? #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:07 pm Storygeeks When
testing a story idea... you should never start with the log line...
always start with the premise line ... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:07 pm teenierussell @Storygeeks a
logline for me will tell me in just a couple of lines what
the story is #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:07 pm Storygeeks Premise
line and log line are very different things.. #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:08 pm teenierussell @Storygeeks what is
a premise line? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:08 pm Storygeeks @Taroj... a story
is: a metaphor for a human being on a journey
where they change in the end. #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:09 pm Storygeeks @teenierussell... glad you
asked :)n #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:09 pm frogfall Hi.
Would the "story" simply be what people say when you ask "what
is the movie about"? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:09 pm TaroJ RT @Storygeeks:
@Taroj... a story is: a metaphor for a human being
on a journey where they change in the end. #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:09 pm Storygeeks Premise
line is: the right, natural, and true sturcture of your story told
in one sentence #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:10 pm Storygeeks Log line
is : the high concept of your story expressed as a SHORT
one-liner #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:11 pm Storygeeks @frogfall... no...
story means soemthing specific... very specific... (see
my post a sec ago). #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:11 pm BrevityRulesOK #scriptchat
Nice to be here. #
2013-02-17 8:11 pm Storygeeks Always
start witht he premise line... that will save your bacon... you
have to know if you have a story BEFORE you start writing
#
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:12 pm scriptguyphil @Storygeeks can you
give an example of a premise line please? #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:12 pm Storygeeks The
premise line is the only way for you to know that ... but you have
to know what a premise line is... most writers don't #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:12 pm teenierussell @Storygeeks so
beginning, middle and end, tell it as it is rather than
try to sell the idea? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:12 pm Storygeeks They
think the premise line is only for pitching... WRONGG! #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:13 pm teenierussell @BrevityRulesOK Hi
Michael, lovely to see you here #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:13 pm scriptguyphil #scriptchat
and sorry for jumping in without saying hi - 'HI'!!
2013-02-17 8:14 pm LeeZJessup RT @ozzywood:
Scriptmag : Get A New Story - Are You Really Too
Busy to Write http://t.co/KZ3Z4mbl #screenwriting
#amwriting #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:14 pm teenierussell @scriptguyphil Hi Phil!
#scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:15 pm LisaFromNYC Hi all.
Catching up on the posts #ScriptChat
2013-02-17 8:15 pm BrevityRulesOK RT @scriptguyphil:
@Storygeeks can you give an example of a
premise line please? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:16 pm Storygeeks @scriptguyphil... Godfather:
When the innocent, youngest son of a
powerful mafia Godfather discovers #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:16 pm Storygeeks he
agrees to join the family to exact revenge and re-establish the
family’s honor, #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:16 pm teenierussell @LisaFromNYC Hi Lisa!
#scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:17 pm Storygeeks until
his actions force him to cross a line he was never meant to cross,
dooming him to become the next Godfather. #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:17 pm LisaFromNYC @Storygeeks when you
say premise are you referring to theme? #
ScriptChat
2013-02-17 8:17 pm Storygeeks That is
the premise for the Godfather II... more than just beginning
middle end... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:17 pm Storygeeks It
reveals the entire structure of the story!!! #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:17 pm scriptguyphil @Storygeeks - thanks
jeff, but how would you say that is different to
the logline? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:18 pm Storygeeks @lisafromnyc... NOOOOO..
theme is not premise... see my earlier
post ... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:18 pm BrevityRulesOK Thanks
on the premise line of the G-father. What makes that different
to a logline of the same movie? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:18 pm Storygeeks Log line
is the high concept... liek for the movie jaws... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:19 pm Storygeeks Premise:When
a big city cop moves to a small coastal town
dependent on tourism, #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:19 pm Storygeeks he must
team with a crusty sailor and an oceanographer to convince
the doubting, money-grubbing townsfolk #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:19 pm frogfall @Storygeeks So if
that "jpurneying" human did not undergo a
change, there would be no story? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:19 pm Storygeeks to close
their beaches due to a giant man-eating shark, until the shark
strikes, #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:20 pm Storygeeks thus
forcing the townsfolk to allow the cop and his buddies to take on
the shark mano-a-mano. #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:20 pm Storygeeks that's
the premise.... Logline: Giant, monster shark terrorizes small
coastal town.n #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:21 pm Storygeeks See the
difference between a logline and premise line????? Very
IMPORTANT distinctios... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:21 pm Storygeeks Most
writers dont' know this... nor do development executives!!! I
might add #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:22 pm teenierussell @Storygeeks I think
what you call a premise is what I've always
referred to as a logline, I wonder if it's a US vs UK
thing? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:22 pm Storygeeks @frogfall.... YEP...
if no change... then what's the point??? All you
have is a situation.. a problem to be solved #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:23 pm Storygeeks @frogfall.... ala
Cloverfield... no story therre... just a situation to be
solved... " gotta havve a human being changing... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:24 pm Storygeeks @teenierussell.... HA .. no
it's a story thing!!!! Not cultural... #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:24 pm teenierussell When I
first started writing, I used to jump into the writing without a
premise line or even an outline - waste of time #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:25 pm BrevityRulesOK Can you
clue us into the difference between premise and theme? #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:25 pm Storygeeks @teenierussell... YYYESSS...
exactly... you set yourself up for a
painful process... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:25 pm Storygeeks @scriptguyphil.... they you
Europeans are on the right track :) #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:26 pm Storygeeks @BrevityRulesok... Premise
is the entire structgure of your story in
one line... theme is the moral question... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:26 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... you are
trying to convey... BIG DIFFERENCE #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:27 pm Bang2write @scriptguyphil yes
seconded Phil, often phrased here as the "What if
...?" Question @Storygeeks #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:27 pm writerscanvas RT @jeannevb:
Tonight on EURO & USA #scriptchat guest
@storygeeks talking what makes a story a story http://t.co/zzqVJSYu
2013-02-17 8:27 pm Storygeeks I'LL BE
COMING TO LONDON TO TEACH MY PREMISE
DEVELOPMENT CLASS AT SOME POINT :)n #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:28 pm teenierussell RT @Storygeeks:
@BrevityRulesok... Premise is the entire structgure
of your story in one line... theme is the moral
question... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:28 pm Storygeeks @bang2write... yeah...
but the "what if" is really more clued into the
log line... in my opinion... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:28 pm Storygeeks Please
read my article on Script Magazine on high concept... it's very
helpful... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:30 pm BrevityRulesOK So you
should be able to clearly identify 1. theme 2. premise line 3.
logline. This will crystallize your development process.
#scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:30 pm Bang2write @Storygeeks so where
is the hook, the logline or premise line? #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:30 pm teenierussell RT @Storygeeks:
ILL BE COMING TO LONDON TO TEACH MY
PREMISE DEVELOPMENT CLASS AT SOME POINT :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:30 pm Storygeeks Here is
link: http://t.co/rkoormX8 #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:31 pm scriptguyphil @Storygeeks i
disagree. 'what if...' takes you through the entirety of
the story, otherwise it would stop halfway through!! #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:31 pm Storygeeks @bang2write: hook is
part of the logline... is in convened in the
premise... sure... but doesn't have to be... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:31 pm BrevityRulesOK Thanks
for link.n #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:32 pm Storygeeks @bang2write:... the
premise line is for you as the writer to guide you...
it's not for the ptich fest... it's your lifeline #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:32 pm Storygeeks @sritpguyphil... "What
if martians invaded the earth?" Uh.. how does
this take you through the entire story? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:33 pm teenierussell We're
halfway through Euro #scriptchat with
guest @Storygeeks
talking about stories #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:34 pm Storygeeks You can
see the problem here in this chat... there is no consensus on
these important ideas... I'm trying to fix that :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:34 pm Storygeeks Premise
line is the #1 issue I work on with my consulting clients... #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:35 pm Storygeeks and
dont' even get me going on writer's block :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:35 pm teenierussell So once
you have an idea and are able to write a premise line, that's
your story? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:36 pm BrevityRulesOK If there
is no consensus here, where is there consensus on these
concepts? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:36 pm storydepth The 7
Deadly Dialogue Sins: After decades in the biz, these are the
dialogue errors I see over... http://t.co/IvNcizL3
#scriptchat #botw
2013-02-17 8:36 pm scriptmag The 7
Deadly Dialogue Sins: After decades in the biz, these are the
dialogue errors I see over and o... http://t.co/4YcWsrtJ
#scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:36 pm Storygeeks @teenierussell.... no...
that's the big-picture map of your story... it's
the banks of the river that form the flow ... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:37 pm scriptguyphil @Storygeeks because
you don't just ask 'what if' once - you ask it
through the entire script (at least we do in europe!) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:37 pm A2Jason RT @scriptmag:
The 7 Deadly Dialogue Sins: After decades in the
biz, these are the dialogue errors I see over and o...
http://t.co/4YcWsrtJ #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:37 pm Bang2write @Storygeeks premise
is a great guide for writers, I agree; but I think
its function in pitches also important TBH #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:37 pm Storygeeks @teenierussell... but now
you have a guide... the carnary in the coal
mine... when you go off on a tangent... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:37 pm Storygeeks @teenierussell... the
premise line can help you find your way back to
the story... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:38 pm Storygeeks @bang2write... YES... I
AGREE.. it is important.. but you would write
it differentoly for the pitch... more seducdtive #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:38 pm ScriptPunk Anyone
know much about getting rights to a book? #scriptchat #gfilm
2013-02-17 8:38 pm teenierussell @Storygeeks Gotcha!
#scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:39 pm Storygeeks @scriptguyphil... well...
you guys have always been head of the curve
compared to us US folks ... :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:40 pm Storygeeks @scriptpunk... yes...
it's the same as for a script... :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:41 pm richionwurah RT @scriptmag:
The 7 Deadly Dialogue Sins: After decades in the
biz, these are the dialogue errors I see over and o...
http://t.co/4YcWsrtJ #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:41 pm Bang2write @Storygeeks why not
seal it in from the off and seduce YOURSELF
first? If you don't believe 100%, no one else will ;) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:41 pm Storygeeks The
premise line also helps you avoid a huge problem.. what I call
backing into your story... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:41 pm rdlln Contact directly if
possible, use rep or lawyer if not RT @ScriptPunk:
Anyone know much about getting rights to a book? #scriptchat
#gfilm
2013-02-17 8:41 pm mb_hatter RT @scriptmag:
The 7 Deadly Dialogue Sins: After decades in the
biz, these are the dialogue errors I see over and o...
http://t.co/4YcWsrtJ #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:42 pm SabinaGiado Delving
into my protagonist. I can see her now - I know what gives her
pain & joy, where she comes from and what she shuts
out. #
scriptchat.
2013-02-17 8:42 pm BrevityRulesOK Backing
into your story?n #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:42 pm Storygeeks @bang2write... what I
mean is... you leave some detaiils out of your
pitch to lure them... you already are in love w/ ur
story.. #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:43 pm Storygeeks Backing
into ur story means you write write write and then lose ur
way... then... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:43 pm Storygeeks ...
backtrack and finally do a premise line only to discover you have
writing the wrong bloody story..... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:43 pm girl_onthego RT @ScriptPunk:
Anyone know much about getting rights to a book?
#scriptchat #gfilm
2013-02-17 8:44 pm Storygeeks .. You
started your process in the wrong place (writing first) then
backtracked when you should have started with the prmise
#
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:44 pm Storygeeks I have
this problem with writers all the time... they are not happy when
I tell them they wasted months of time writing a book #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:45 pm Storygeeks Better
to know you don't have a story with legs at the premise level..
rahter than on page 400... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:45 pm BrevityRulesOK What
would be your recommended process before starting to write
the story?n #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:46 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... Gr8
question... I think everyone is unique that
way... but... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:47 pm M__Lou RT @scriptmag:
The 7 Deadly Dialogue Sins: After decades in the
biz, these are the dialogue errors I see over and o...
http://t.co/4YcWsrtJ #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:47 pm teenierussell @Storygeeks Do you
test the premise on other people to see if it
really works? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:47 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... what I
wud recommend: First premise line (takes
weeks to get it right)...then... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:48 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... then do
the log line... then give both of these to ppl
who know story and get feedback... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:48 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... don't
give it to your mother... she'll jus tell you what
you want to hear.. :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:48 pm BrevityRulesOK @robinbellwriter missing
your #scriptchat hashtag. Reading your
convo with Teenie on the side :-) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:49 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... then
when you know you have a story and not
something else... you are ready to start pages... or an
outline #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:49 pm frogfall RT @Storygeeks:
Better to know you don't have a story with legs at
the premise level.. rahter than on page 400... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:49 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok.. ru
getting my responses... :( #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:50 pm BrevityRulesOK So you
develop the premise line out of the rough idea you have of the
theme? Or do you discover the theme as you go? #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:50 pm Storygeeks @teenierussell... yes...
absolutely.. see my reply to @brevityrulesok #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:50 pm BrevityRulesOK I am
getting your response. Thanks. Just slow updating.n #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:51 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... gr8
question... the theme comes from the moral
probolem of your protagonist... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:51 pm BrevityRulesOK Yupn #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:51 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... the
moral problem of the protagonist drives your
entire story and sets the theme— critical structure
element #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:52 pm teenierussell @BrevityRulesOK oops,
sorry. #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:52 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... theme
doesn't come from developing the prmise..
.unless it does... :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:52 pm BrevityRulesOK This is
really helpful. Thank you!n #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:53 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... this is
not about some paint-by-nubmerrs thiing..
everyone will get their in a unique way... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:53 pm teenierussell RT @Storygeeks:
@brevityrulesok... gr8 question... the theme comes
from the moral probolem of your protagonist... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:53 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... but I'm
offering an approach that works.. just make
it your own and run with it... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:53 pm GREGBIELA RT @jeannevb:
Tonight on EURO & USA #scriptchat guest
@storygeeks talking what makes a story a story http://t.co/zzqVJSYu
2013-02-17 8:54 pm BrevityRulesOK I
understand. Paint by numbers doesn't help, but understanding
structure does. #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:55 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok..... YEP...
structure is king... sturcture is the one tool
every writer needs to learn about... but most don't #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:55 pm teenierussell @Storygeeks
@BrevityRulesOK Yes, seeing how others do it always
helps, even if it's not how we end up doing it ourselves
#scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:55 pm robinbellwriter @BrevityRulesOK my fault
I missed the #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:56 pm Storygeeks @teenierussell... yes...
My mantra: Listen to everyone, try
everything... follow no one... ur your own guru .... :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:56 pm BrevityRulesOK My
approach has been similar. Ask 'what if?' to kickstart the idea.
Then work through the premise. Then develop a logline. #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:56 pm teenierussell RT @Storygeeks
YEP... structure is king... sturcture is the one tool
every writer needs to learn about... but most dont #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:57 pm BrevityRulesOK Logline
is the tough part for me. Then outline in detail. Only then start
writing, All the way through the writing, check theme #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:57 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... then you
are a smart guy ... :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:58 pm Storygeeks @brevityrulesok... if log
line is tough then read my article on high
concept in script magazine... it will help... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:58 pm arbutus_films RT @scriptmag:
The 7 Deadly Dialogue Sins: After decades in the
biz, these are the dialogue errors I see over and o...
http://t.co/4YcWsrtJ #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:58 pm BrevityRulesOK I try to
work smart. That helps with getting lost in the fog :-) #
scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:59 pm ozzywood Silver
Linings Playbook - 30min featurette http://t.co/Y8o5nPRY
#screenwriting #amwriting #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:59 pm Storygeeks Please
visit my website http://t.co/um3NWv3e and "like" me on
Facebook http://t.co/antr8g4X... :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 8:59 pm teenierussell Thank
you for the chat @Storygeeks I'll have to read back the
transcript, so much info! #scriptchat
2013-02-17 9:00 pm Storygeeks And
watch out for me in London... I'm coming to teach there... early
next year or late 2013 :) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 9:00 pm teenierussell RT @Storygeeks:
Please visit my website http://t.co/um3NWv3e and
"like" me on Facebook http://t.co/antr8g4X...
:) #scriptchat
2013-02-17 9:00 pm Storygeeks HAD A
BALL... THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME... IT WAS FUN
BEING HAD... #scriptchat
2013-02-17 9:01 pm teenierussell Fantastic!
RT: @StorygeeksnAnd watch out for me in London... I'm
coming to teach there... early next year or late 2013 :)
#scriptchat
2013-02-17 9:02 pm BrevityRulesOK @Storygeeks Thanks
so much. Much to think about. Defining the
hard things always makes the journey easier. #scriptchat
USA CHAT
2013-02-18 1:00 am zacsanford It's #Scriptchat
o'clock. Please welcome our guest Jeff Lyons
(@storygeeks). http://t.co/o7i1YM3P talking
about "testing ideas."
2013-02-18 1:00 am Jamie_LD Yes
folks, it's #scriptchat o'clock and we have wonderful guest
@Storygeeks tonight.
2013-02-18 1:00 am princess_scribe RT @zacsanford:
It's #Scriptchat o'clock. Please welcome our guest
Jeff Lyons (@storygeeks). http://t.co/o7i1YM3P talking
about "testing
ideas."
2013-02-18 1:00 am SarahAlexis4 Time for
#scriptchat, discussing what makes a story a story with
guest @storygeeks.
2013-02-18 1:00 am Storygeeks Ok...
Storygeeks is in the house... let'r rip...n #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:00 am GoIntoTheStory Daily
Dialogue theme for the week: Wedding toast. Today: "Old
School" http://t.co/s1JY45Ff #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:01 am RWWFilm Welcome
to #scriptchat @Storygeeks !
2013-02-18 1:01 am zacsanford2 @Storygeeks - First
off, thanks for doing double duty on both chats
today. Hopefully it won't be too much repetition. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:01 am ChipNotDonald @zacsanford @Storygeeks
Watching "Dirty Harry" along with #
scriptchat tonight. Do I feel lucky?
2013-02-18 1:01 am SarahAlexis4 @Storygeeks Hello
and welcome! #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:01 am nisajaie RT @zacsanford:
It's #Scriptchat o'clock. Please welcome our guest
Jeff Lyons (@storygeeks). http://t.co/o7i1YM3P talking
about "testing
ideas."
2013-02-18 1:01 am Storygeeks So...
what's a story... I asked my workshop yesterday and got 15 diff
answers... how is that possible? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:01 am zacsanford2 If you
have any questions regarding "testing ideas
2013-02-18 1:01 am art1032 Hello #scriptchat
:)
2013-02-18 1:02 am Storygeeks As
writers we should all pretty much have a consensus about this...
yes? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:02 am Storygeeks NOT...
never assume... :)n #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:02 am Storygeeks So...
let me kick it off by saying... Premise and the Premise LIne are
the keys to knowing if you have a story... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:03 am ChipNotDonald @Storygeeks What's
consensus? Especially as relates to writing and
story. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:03 am Storygeeks Lots of
people think they're writing a story and they aren't... not bad or
wrong... but they're not telling a story... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:04 am kim_garland RT @zacsanford:
It's #Scriptchat o'clock. Please welcome our guest
Jeff Lyons (@storygeeks). http://t.co/o7i1YM3P talking
about "testing
ideas."
2013-02-18 1:04 am Storygeeks @chipnotdonald... consensus
means... communal agreement... #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:04 am SarahAlexis4 @Storygeeks In
addition to premise lines what work do you suggest
doing in early dev. to test the strength of a story
concept?n #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:05 am Storygeeks @chipnotdonald... like all
surgeons agree on the meaning of a
scalpel... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:05 am RWWFilm @Storygeeks Difference
between Premise Line and Logline? PL
explores the story for yourself and LL is to sell to
others? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:05 am Storygeeks @sarahalexis4...gr8 question...
I suggest... first figuring out if you
have a story vs. a situationn #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:06 am JonFour Checking
in to #scriptchat. Sounds like a good topic.
2013-02-18 1:06 am ChipNotDonald @Storygeeks Coming
at this cold, I'd say "story" is more subjective to
define than "scalpel," though. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:06 am Storygeeks @rwwfilm... kind
of... :) Premise line is the total structure of your story
told in one line... it is for you. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:07 am Storygeeks @rwwfilm... log line
is your high concept in a short sentence "Monster
shark terrorizes small coastal town" Jaws #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:07 am Storygeeks @rwwfilm... Premise
is your canary in the coal mine.. it keeps you on
the straight and narrow ... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:08 am Storygeeks @rrwfilm... log line
give you an idea how high concept your story is..
see my article in script magazine on this... link coming
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:08 am RWWFilm @Storygeeks Love
that analogy. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:09 am Al_1701 So, when
making a log line should be how you sell your idea and a
premise line is the guide for your writing. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:09 am Storygeeks @chipnotdonald... yeah...
I agree... but few writers really "get" what a
premise is... they think its just a pitch tool #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:09 am Storygeeks @chipnotdonald... it is so
much more... hugely so.. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:09 am ChipNotDonald @Storygeeks Ahhh...that
makes sense. I'm probably in that group
too. I'm looking forward to hearing it defined. =) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:09 am Storygeeks @Al 1701...
Yes... but log line also helps your writing... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:11 am zacsanford2 @Storygeeks Q. So
how can you test your idea to know if you have a
feature script in the concept? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:11 am Storygeeks Definition:
A story premise is a container that holds the essence of
your story’s right, true, and natural structure.n #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:11 am Al_1701 Like
I've had this idea since I was in grade school. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:11 am RWWFilm @Storygeeks For
comparison. What would the Premise Line for Jaws
be by your definition? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:12 am Al_1701 The sun
has destroyed the inner Solar System and Mankind lives on
the moons of the gas giants. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:12 am Storygeeks Definition:
The log line is your high concept stated in a single (short)
sentence.n #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:12 am Al_1701 Would
that be a log line or a premise line. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:12 am kim_garland Good q
“@RWWFilm: @Storygeeks For comparison. What would the
Premise Line for Jaws be by your definition? #scriptchat”
2013-02-18 1:13 am Storygeeks @rrwfilm... Jaws
Premise: : When a big city-cop moves to a small
coastal town dependent on tourism, #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:13 am Storygeeks @rrwfilm...he must
team with a crusty sailor and an oceanographer to
convince the doubting, money-grubbing townsfolk #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:13 am Storygeeks @rrwfilm... to close
their beaches due to a giant man-eating shark,
until the shark strikes, #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:13 am Storygeeks @rrwfilm..., thus
forcing the townsfolk to allow the cop and his
buddies to take on the shark mano-a-mano.n #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:14 am Storygeeks @rrwfilm... vs log
line: monster shark terrorizes small coastal town...
see the difference? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:14 am Storygeeks @kim_garland... sorry
... sent your answer to @rrfilm :) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:15 am SarahAlexis4 @Storygeeks What
stands out to you as red flags in a premise? And
what stands out as signs of a strong premise? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:15 am Storygeeks @AI_1701.. .that
would be more log line... Premise gives the entire
strucgture of your story !!! That's a huge difference #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:15 am zacsanford2 @Storygeeks I'd
still say add more than just "monster shark terrorizes
small coastal town" as a logline in a query letter.
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:15 am ericnjones @Al_1701 Sounds
intriguing. As a writer, I'd want to be able to write
that. As a reader, I'd want to read that. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:16 am CrispyPhoenix RT @Cilly247:
My good friend Lisa is making a short film. Pls come
see what its all about, thanks!x http://t.co/sXsggIh8
#SupportIndieFilm
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:16 am Phucopheles A log
line is a broad overview in one sentence, while a premise
describes the major elements in order. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:16 am Storygeeks @SarahAlexis4... red
flags: no protagonist, no moral problem defined,
no opponent structure defined, no core relationship
defind #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:16 am zacsanford2 @Storygeeks I'd go
somewhere in the middle of your examples of
logline and premise to sell the concept. Maybe that's
just me. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:16 am kim_garland @Storygeeks PL seems
very helpful. I write LL but feels limiting in
early stages of script. PL gives bigger path to follow #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:16 am Storygeeks @sarahalexis4... strong
items: all the things present I just red flagged
:) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:17 am zacsanford2 Last
week's podcast by @starterscript had a great discussion on
loglines. Check it out. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:17 am ericnjones RT @Storygeeks:
@SarahAlexis4... red flags: no protagonist, no
moral problem defined, no opponent structure defined, no
core
relationship defind #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:17 am Storygeeks @Phucopheles... yeah,
that's how most writers see them... I think this
is very short sighted... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:18 am Storygeeks @zacsanfor2... No.. I
agree... selling and writing are two diff
problems... how you sell your story #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:18 am Phucopheles I would
guess that a logline allows a script reader to quickly tell if that
is their type of script and either read or not read #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:18 am art1032 RT @zacsanford2:
Last week's podcast by @starterscript had a
great
discussion on loglines. Check it out. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:18 am Storygeeks @zacsanford2... isn't
how you build tools for your writing process...
premise line is for you to help you through process #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:19 am Storygeeks @phucopheles... absolutely...
lots of business reasons for a log line..
but it also helps you as a writer gage high concept #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:20 am Storygeeks I'm
about helping writers write.. not just sell, if you don't have a story
you won't get in anyone's door unless your JJ Abrams #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:21 am zacsanford2 Reminder,
if you have any questions about "testing your ideas
2013-02-18 1:21 am ChipNotDonald @Storygeeks
@zacsanford2 So how would you relate the premise
line to a beat sheet? #Scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:21 am Storygeeks and bar
none, the biggest issue writers have is knowing if they have a
story or not... it's not as obvious as you might assume #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:21 am Al_1701 A log
line could also be worked into tag lines for advertisement. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:21 am Storygeeks for
example... Cloverfield, Contagion, Murder She Wrote...
entertaining situations... not stories... (and made lots
of $$$ :)) #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:22 am PitchfestBob RT @Storygeeks:
the biggest issue writers have is knowing if they
have a story or not... its not as obvious as you might
assume #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:22 am Storygeeks @Al_1701.. Yep...
and often are... but again... sales are important...
but you have to know if your story is going to work first
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:23 am zacsanford2 @Storygeeks Q. So
how does one take their PL to test to see if they
have a full story and not just a situation. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:23 am SarahAlexis4 @Storygeeks Q: What
are some elements you have found to be
universal in strong story concepts? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:23 am art1032 RT @PitchfestBob:
RT @Storygeeks: the biggest issue writers have
is knowing if they have a story or not... its not as
obvious as you might
assume #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:23 am Storygeeks My
premise development apporach assures you that you will know
early on if your story will work... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:23 am Al_1701 I've
found you know you have a story when the writing comes easily.
It just seems to flow. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:23 am Storygeeks better
to know at the premise level if you story has legs (or not) than
on page 120 (or 400)... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:24 am Storygeeks @AL_1701... Ok.. I
had a woman who wrote a 500pg book on her trip
to Peru... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:24 am Storygeeks @AL_1701... the
writing flowed, easy, joyful... for 4 YEARS she
wrote... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:24 am ericnjones @Storygeeks Q. Once
you've developed premise, logline, etc - who
do you pitch it to to "test the idea"? Friends?
Fellow writers? #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:24 am Storygeeks @AL_1701... and then
everybody told her it sucked and she was
clueless... she had a traveloge, not a story... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:25 am Storygeeks @Al_1701...sometimes writing
ease is a clue, but better you rely on
tools... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:25 am ericnjones @Storygeeks ... what
may be a great idea to me, may not be to
anyone else. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:26 am Storygeeks @ericnjones...gr8 question...
unit test your stuff with people who know
story... not your mother... you dont' have time ... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:26 am Storygeeks @ericnjones... talk to
people who know what they're doing... #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:26 am Phucopheles Q Is
there room in HC features commercially to build complex,
engaging characters? Or is it all whiz-bang now? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:27 am Storygeeks @ericnjones... exactly...
so get opinions of people your respect... at
the end of the day you have to love what you're writing..
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:27 am Al_1701 RT @Storygeeks:
I belong to a writing board. Is that a good place to
bounce around ideas? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:27 am Storygeeks @Phucopheles... Not sure
what you mean... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:27 am wcmartell @ericnjones I tell
friends who regularly go to the movies that I saw a
test screening with Brendan Fraser - then pitch my story.
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:28 am DannyManus When you
pitch people your idea, gauge their reactions to know if
you're emotionally connecting and selling it right #scriptchat
#
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:28 am Storygeeks @AL_1701 ...
HA... see my article on writing groups in Script
Magazine... I will say no more... :) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:28 am Storygeeks @wcmartell.... HA!!! #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:29 am zacsanford2 RT @DannyManus:
When you pitch people your idea, gauge their
reactions 2 know if youre emotionally connecting &
selling it right #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:29 am hayphoto_ca Join me
for a #scriptchat TweetChat at: http://t.co/GDwi27mr
#
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:30 am zacsanford2 Here is @Storygeek's
article on Writing Groups: http://t.co/GtPn0ADw
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:30 am Storygeeks Here is
the high-concept article: http://t.co/rkoormX8 #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:30 am zacsanford2 So we're
at the halfway point. Make sure you get those questions into
@Storygeeks regarding "testing your
ideas". #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:30 am jpopefilms Just
discovered #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:30 am PAX_Tweets RT @zacsanford2:
Here is @Storygeek's article on Writing Groups:
http://t.co/GtPn0ADw #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:30 am GoIntoTheStory Interview:
20-minute video with Judd Apatow, Buck Henry, Jon Lucas
and Harold Ramis http://t.co/k6GQKzT6 #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:30 am Storygeeks Here is
writing grps: http://t.co/1w0KhQY2 #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:31 am art1032 RT @zacsanford2:
Here is @Storygeek's article on Writing Groups:
http://t.co/GtPn0ADw #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:31 am zacsanford2 @jpopefilms Welcome...
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:31 am art1032 RT @Storygeeks:
Here is the high-concept article:
http://t.co/rkoormX8 #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:31 am hayphoto_ca @zacsanford2 but when
you pitch, are you gauging producer reaction
or friends who aren't thinking the commercial viability?
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:31 am Storygeeks halfway
already... wow... having fun... din't even noticen #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:31 am Al_1701 RT @Storygeeks:
@AL_1701 ... HA... see my article on writing
groups in Script Magazine The Be Afraid article? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:32 am zacsanford2 @hayphoto_ca I pitch
my ideas to people who know story, execs and
also the random average moviegoer. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:32 am Storygeeks @hayphoto... Pitching
isn't my thing... I'm about giving writers tools for
productivity... fyi #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:33 am DannyManus @Storygeeks I've
always said 90% of writers groups are just the blind
leading the blind. Good article. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:33 am hayphoto_ca @zacsanford2 how do
you connect with the "random average
moviegoer
2013-02-18 1:33 am Storygeeks If you
go away with anytghing from this... I want to give you two ideas:
Premise is your lifeline... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am hayphoto_ca @Storygeeks what
kind of tools? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am hayphoto_ca Sorry I
came in late #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am zacsanford2 @Storygeeks You have
a solid PL, a solid outline... yet somehow the
script still comes up short. Ideas? Suggestions? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am brunospaws RT @GoIntoTheStory:
Interview: 20-minute video with Judd Apatow,
Buck Henry, Jon Lucas and Harold Ramis http://t.co/k6GQKzT6
#
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am Storygeeks ... and
learn story structure... you are writing with both arms tied
behind your back if you don't know structure... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am zacsanford2 @hayphoto_ca Friends
and family members not in the business. As
long as they promise to be honest. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am zilkerfilms RT
@GoIntoTheStory Interview: 20-minute video with Judd Apatow,
Buck Henry, Jon Lucas and Harold Ramis http://t.co/4iC0iWXW
#
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am ChipNotDonald @DannyManus @Storygeeks
I'm assuming that writers' websites like
Zoetrope are even worse? The dead leading the blind? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am wcmartell @hayphoto_ca No - you
need people who go to the cinema on a
regular basis. That's not the average person. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am AndreaLMcNeill @hayphoto_ca It's
really hard to write for the market. Write what you
want, what's in your heart, but learn how to do it well #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am zacsanford2 @DannyManus @Storygeeks I agree
on most writing groups being
bad, but I think I finally found a really solid one. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:34 am Storygeeks @hayphoto: tools:
my 7 step premise development process (&
workshop) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:35 am Jamie_LD RT @Storygeeks:
... learn story structure... you are writing with both
arms tied behind your back if you don't know structure #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:35 am Storygeeks @hayphoto... my story
development methodolgy using the
Enneagram system... Enneagram-STory Bridge... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:35 am ericnjones RT @Storygeeks:
Here is writing grps: http://t.co/1w0KhQY2 #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:35 am hayphoto_ca @zacsanford2 ah...
yes but so often I've heard honest people say
nice things and even I see problems... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am art1032 @hayphoto_ca Welcome
and don't worry,what u missed will be
posted in a transcript:) Enjoy:) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am ChipNotDonald RT @Jamie_LD:
RT @Storygeeks: ... learn story structure... you are
writing with both arms tied behind your back if you don't
know
structure #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am hayphoto_ca @wcmartell how
often is regular basis? I generally see at least 1
movie a week, recently its been a lot of screeners. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am Storygeeks @zacsanford2... but
friends and family unless they are execs at
Paramount don't know squat about story... I'm just sayin'
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am zacsanford2 @hayphoto_ca Easy way
to test if they're honest... come up with the
worst pitch possible and see what their reaction is. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am wcmartell The
reason why I say I saw a test screening is so people won't worry
about offending me. It was some crappy Brendan Fraser
film. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am DannyManus @ChipNotDonald Some are
better than others, but most peer review
sites are a waste of time and energy #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am Storygeeks @zacsanford2... HA... I
guess that might work ... :) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am zacsanford2 @Storygeeks friends
and family are more for the hook/concept.
Industry peeps are more for story. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am hayphoto_ca @AndreaLMcNeill I write
what I want, but I've been mainly in short
stories. Often casting one day, write to casting, then
shoot #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:36 am Jamie_LD LMAO,
good idea. RT @zacsanford2: @hayphoto_ca ...come up with
the worst pitch possible and see what their reaction is.
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:37 am wcmartell @hayphoto_ca That is
regular. I know people who haven't seen a
movie in the cinema in *years* - maybe decades! #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:37 am hayphoto_ca @AndreaLMcNeill but
those are short stories, now I'm looking to
make web-series and feature so I need more story building
skills #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:37 am Storygeeks Re
getting help: my mantra: listen to everyone, try everything...
follow no one. you are ur own guru. I hate gurus... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:37 am JonFour @Storygeeks What is
"structure" to you? 3-act? Heroes' Journey?
Something else? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:38 am AndreaLMcNeill At some
point you have to stop looking for help/advice and just do it.
Everyone has a different opinion. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:38 am PAX_Tweets RT @Storygeeks:
Re getting help: my mantra: listen to everyone, try
everything... follow no one. you are ur own guru. I hate
gurus... #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:38 am hayphoto_ca @wcmartell wow...
decades. All TV watchers or they just no fiction at
all? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:38 am ericnjones RT @Storygeeks:
Re getting help: my mantra: listen to everyone, try
everything... follow no one. you are ur own guru. I hate
gurus... #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:38 am Storygeeks @jonfour... 3 acts
is bull. It is not about writing... run the other way
from 3 acts.. useless... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:38 am zacsanford2 RT @AndreaLMcNeill:
At some point you have to stop looking for
help/advice and just do it. Everyone has a different
opinion. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:39 am art1032 RT @AndreaLMcNeill:
At some point you have to stop looking for
help/advice and just do it. Everyone has a different
opinion. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:39 am DannyManus @Storygeeks I dont
even think Gurus like being called gurus. It's just
a label OTHER people put on them. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:39 am AndreaLMcNeill @hayphoto_ca Structure
is KING. Learn it. Live it. Write it. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:39 am hayphoto_ca @AndreaLMcNeill Oh I do
just do, made 13 short films (many I have
also wrote) in the last 3 years. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:39 am wcmartell @hayphoto_ca TV. They
never leave the house. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:39 am Storygeeks @jonfour... story
structure is the natural structure of every story... too
complicated for a chat... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:39 am art1032 RT @Storygeeks:
@jonfour... 3 acts is bull. It is not about writing...
run the other way from 3 acts.. useless... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:39 am GCGeek @zacsanford2 @Storygeeks I like
to test w/reg folks for emotional
response. Then folks in the know for story/marketability.
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:39 am hayphoto_ca @Storygeeks "three
acts is bull" I was just told the opposite today,
elaborate? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:40 am AndreaLMcNeill @hayphoto_ca Then
maybe you should be telling us. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:40 am Storygeeks @andrealmcneill... YEP #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:40 am scriptdreric Perhaps
unrelated to the conversation on #Scriptchat, but
the
Support Something Sunday project for this week is...
http://t.co/ByQJNdeN
2013-02-18 1:40 am AndreaLMcNeill @hayphoto_ca Hollywood
wants a three act structure. Sorry. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:40 am Storygeeks @HAYPHOTO... acts are
part of physcial stage production, not
writing... story structure forms your story, not acts #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:41 am LynneRice story
structure simplified .... and then what happened..... and how did
it end up? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:41 am zacsanford2 RT @scriptdreric:
Unrelated to the conversation, but the Support
Something Sunday project for this week... http://t.co/K2bLohgX
#
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:41 am hayphoto_ca @AndreaLMcNeill oh no,
I'm no expert. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:41 am Storygeeks @hayphoto... only
commercial tv uses acts (and theatre) so they can
sell soap... it has nothing to do with storytelling #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:41 am Jamie_LD @zacsanford2 DM #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:41 am Storygeeks @andrealmcneill... yes,
they do... so we comply ... but we don't have
to.. if we rely on structure... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:41 am wcmartell Act 1:
You get your cat up a tree.nAct 2: You throw rocks at him.nAct
3: You get him down from the tree. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:42 am NiceConundrum Love @jengrisanti
ABC's of story structure! Excited for tonight! The
chat is already hopping! #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:42 am AndreaLMcNeill And they
want a log line. Hollywood DEMANDS the one sentence
description of what your movie is. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:42 am Jamie_LD I second
that. RT @AndreaLMcNeill: @hayphoto_ca Structure is
KING. Learn it. Live it. Write it. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:42 am sdarancette If
anyone cares, here is the link to tonight's live stream of the WGA
AWARDS: http://t.co/ojWIwhDi #tvwriterchat
#scriptchat #writing
2013-02-18 1:42 am zacsanford2 @Jamie_LD ha ha...
I was just getting ready to write to you. :) #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:42 am ericnjones A story
about family, greed, religion, & oil, centered around a
turn-of-the-century prospector in the early days of the
business #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:42 am PitchfestBob RT @wcmartell:
Act 1: You get your cat up a tree.Act 2: You throw
rocks at him.Act 3: You get him down from the tree. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:42 am Storygeeks I'll be
writing an article for Script Mag on 3-act structure and why it is
useles... fyi #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:43 am zacsanford2 While @Storygeeks
may say "three acts is bull"... all studio movies
fall into a version of the three act structure. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:43 am art1032 RT @sdarancette:
If anyone cares, here is the link to tonight's live
stream of the WGA AWARDS: http://t.co/ojWIwhDi #tvwriterchat
#
scriptchat #writing
2013-02-18 1:43 am Storygeeks @andrealmcneill... yes re
log line... and you need one as a writer... it
helps you gauge your high concept... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:43 am zacsanford2 curious
to read. RT @Storygeeks: Ill be writing an article for Script
Mag on 3-act structure and why it is useles... fyi #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:43 am ericnjones @Storygeeks If
someone other than PTA had pitched the logline for
THERE WILL BE BLOOD - he probably would be told to can
it. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:44 am zacsanford2 @Storygeeks So would
you also say The Hero's Journey or Save the
Cat is also bull? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:44 am hayphoto_ca @zacsanford2 thats
what I mean, so which is it? 3 acts or just write a
story and see where the chips land? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:44 am Storygeeks @zacsanford2... yeah...
I know they think they do... :) complicated for
a chat session... I think its all smoke and morrors #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:44 am DannyManus @ericnjones This
doesn't tell us what the story is about...so is this a
premise line? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:44 am wcmartell @zacsanford2 Plus, 3
act structure has been around about 2,400
years - and has been used to create stories since then.
Basic. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:44 am Al_1701 Why do I
even try? I'm stuck in Michigan. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:44 am TheWriteScript @AndreaLMcNeill I hear
ya. #scriptchat #screenwriting #wisdom
2013-02-18 1:45 am ericnjones Many
writers I know only seem excited when they hear the words:
contained, zombie, werewolf, vampire, etc... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:45 am Storygeeks @hayphoto... if you
learn story structure the chips will land properly...
3 acts won't even enter into it... honest #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:45 am hayphoto_ca @Storygeeks but if
it works, so what if its smoke and mirrors. Main
goal is to write a story that someone can follow and
enjoyn #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:45 am anniewood YES!“@AndreaLMcNeill:
At some point you have to stop looking for
help/advice and just do it. Everyone has a different
opinion. #
scriptchat”
2013-02-18 1:45 am DannyManus @storygeeks Saying 3
Act structure is bull is misleading. It's
necessary for hwood. Perhaps some format of 3 act is bull
#
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:45 am wcmartell @ericnjones THERE
WILL BE BLOOD is based on a famous novel,
so he just had to show up with the book. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:45 am zacsanford2 @hayphoto_ca I follow
Hero's Journey/STC for when I outline. Which
is just a diferent version of the 3 act structure. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:45 am Al_1701 How can
I get noticed by people who could help me get a career
started? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:45 am nisajaie RT @Storygeeks:
I'll be writing an article for Script Mag on 3-act
structure and why it is useles... fyi #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:45 am Storygeeks #wcmartell...
no... 3 acts was popularized in the modern era... the
Greeks used acts as part of scene trnasitions... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:46 am zacsanford2 RT @DannyManus:
Saying 3 Act structure is bull is misleading. Its
necessary for hwood. Perhaps some format of 3 act is bull
#
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:46 am rdlln -- @DannyManus
@Storygeeks I prefer a wide range of free
feedback on the initial drafts before paying for 1
professional opinion
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:46 am Storygeeks @wcmartell... but it
was never the rule... Syd Field brought us this gift
33 years ago... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:46 am Jamie_LD @ericnjones HEY! I'm
writing a contained zombie, werewolf, vampire
screenplay! (I'm kidding! lol) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:46 am DannyManus @Al_1701 Write
better than everyone else. That's all it is. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:46 am Al_1701 3 Act
seems to work more for half hour television shows. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:47 am robjasonclark RT @Jamie_LD:
I second that. RT @AndreaLMcNeill: @hayphoto_ca
Structure is KING. Learn it. Live it. Write it. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:47 am Al_1701 It helps
place the breaks. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:47 am Jamie_LD Best
advice EVER! lol RT @DannyManus: @Al_1701 Write better
than everyone else. That's all it is. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:47 am Storygeeks @zacsanford... yes.. I
love Chris... but hero's journey is not as
universal as the book suggests... long discussion:) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:47 am ericnjones @wcmartell Yeah,
but the thought of adapting Upton Sinclair wouldn't
exactly light execs' hair on fire either. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:47 am Storygeeks @dannymanus... you said
it... :) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:47 am LynneRice @Jamie_LD a zombie
procedural hehe #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:47 am hayphoto_ca @Storygeeks but it
works' doesn't it? I'm looking at a collaboration for
a web-series and a feature this year... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:47 am Al_1701 @DannyManus How do I
get it to the eyeballs though? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:47 am wcmartell @Storygeeks I sold
my first produced script *before* Syd Field - and
every interview with a writer I read mentioned 3 acts. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:48 am SarahAlexis4 @zacsanford2 I usually
do that too. Find a beat sheet helps me flesh
out the story and see where/how something may be lacking.
#
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:48 am Jamie_LD @LynneRice Hahaha!
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:48 am Storygeeks @AL_17-1... yes..
.tv needs acts for commercials... tv is a selling
medium,not an entertainment medium... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:48 am DannyManus @Jamie_LD Thanks!
Everyone ALWAYS asks -how do I get noticed?
That's the honest simple answer - write better than
everyone else. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:48 am robjasonclark RT @Jamie_LD:
Best advice EVER! lol RT @DannyManus:
@Al_1701 Write better than everyone else.
That's all it is. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:48 am hayphoto_ca @Storygeeks ... and
anything I write gets made so I really want to
improve my story skills as I want a great movie/series. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:48 am hayphoto_ca RT @Storygeeks:
@AL_17-1... yes.. .tv needs acts for commercials...
tv is a selling medium,not an entertainment medium...
agreed #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:49 am wcmartell @Al_1701 E-query
with a logline. If the concept is awesome, they will
ask to read. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:49 am hayphoto_ca @robjasonclark lol #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:49 am Storygeeks @wcmartell... it's
ubiquitous... that doesn't make it "real"... this is a
tough subject for a lot of writers... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:49 am GCGeek It entertains me. RT @Storygeeks:
@AL_17-1 tv needs acts for
commercials... tv is a selling medium,not an
entertainment medium. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:49 am zacsanford2 @Al_1701 Win
contests. Get out here and network for a vacation.
Cold call assistants to see if they accept queries. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:49 am ericnjones @wcmartell ...
Beautiful film though. But this is PTA. Tough for an
unrepped scribe to do the same #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:49 am nisajaie @Storygeeks What
about cable TV? Still 3 Acts? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:49 am DannyManus @Al_1701 If it's
great, their eyeballs will find YOU. Social media,
Contests, pitchfests, consultants, networking events etc
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:49 am LynneRice @Al_1701 be part
of the community, participate in the work of others,
network #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:49 am ruth_atkinson RT @DannyManus:
@Jamie_LD Thanks! Everyone ALWAYS asks
-how do I get noticed? That's the honest simple answer -
write better
than everyone else. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:50 am Jamie_LD @DannyManus So true.
Read other scripts, and if you think you can
do better, DO IT! Get noticed by being a GREAT writer. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:50 am Storygeeks @GCGeek... yes...
there are moments... :) we need more of them #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:50 am art1032 RT @DannyManus:
@Al_1701 If it's great, their eyeballs will find
YOU. Social media, Contests, pitchfests, consultants,
networking
events etc #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:50 am ericnjones @DannyManus Not sure
what THAT is. You're right though, it does
read more as a premise than a logline per se. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:50 am zacsanford2 Only 10
more minutes left, so let's try to get back on topic. Send
questions to @Storygeeks re
"testing your idea." #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:51 am Al_1701 @LynneRice I'm not
sure what community to join. I'm a Sci-Fi fantasy
writer. Where should I go? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:51 am Storygeeks But...
we see here where the focus has turned... how do I get noticed
or sell... I'm more about the writing process... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:51 am SarahAlexis4 @DannyManus Speaking
of good work getting noticed, congrats on
the recent success of some of your clients you tweeted
about! #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:51 am LaurieAshbourne @zacsanford2 Yes back
to premise... #scriptchatn #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:52 am hayphoto_ca @Storygeeks okay so
I pass my premise past industry people, how
do I get useful feedback on what the market wants #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:52 am Al_1701 Sorry
for changing the subject. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:52 am Storygeeks Talent
isn't enough... you have to have strong craft... that's where
story structure and premise smarts come in... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:52 am hayphoto_ca @Al_1701 comiccons,
no joke #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:52 am Jamie_LD @Storygeeks The
process IS the important part. You can sell if you
don't have a good grasp of the writing process. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:53 am rdlln -- @DannyManus
what are your thoughts on posting entire scripts
online? Any potential downside provided it's well
written? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:53 am Storygeeks @hayphoto... you will
always be behind the market... by at least a
year... so get over that... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:53 am Jamie_LD @Storygeeks Oops, I
meant CAN'T sell... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:53 am Storygeeks @jamie_LD... exactly...
n #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:54 am Storygeeks @jamie_LD... the
problem is convincing writers (especially
experienced ones) that they need to shore up things #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:54 am SarahAlexis4 @Storygeeks Q: Any
suggestions for taking an idea that might start
as just a situation & developing it into a strong
story? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:54 am hayphoto_ca @Storygeeks so whats
your recommendation on writing something
that sells? I'm guessing write what YOU want made is the
advice? #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:54 am Storygeeks Writing
and storytelling are two different things and require two diff
skill sets... few writers do both well... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:54 am Jamie_LD @hayphoto_ca Great
question! #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:55 am wcmartell @Jamie_LD I can't
SPELL. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:55 am zacsanford2 Chasing
trends is bad RT @Storygeeks: @hayphoto you will always
be behind the market... by at least a year... so get over
that. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:55 am zacsanford2 I see
what you did there. RT @Jamie_LD: @Storygeeks Oops, I
meant CANT sell... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:55 am Storygeeks @sarahAlexis... YES...
always go back to having a protagonist with a
moral problem.. situations don't have that... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:55 am Jamie_LD @wcmartell Haha.
:-) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:55 am hayphoto_ca @wcmartell third
times a charm? :) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:56 am Storygeeks @sarahalexis4... if you
have a protagoinst with a moral problem then
you will have a story and not a situation (ala
Cloverfield) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:56 am GCGeek @Storygeeks Look
forward to reading ur articles. Having good log line
is great. Really testing/developing full story is
critical #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:57 am wcmartell @hayphoto_ca Write
the kind of movie you regularly pay to see. The
genre, not specifics about the genre (trends). #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:57 am ericnjones @Storygeeks Q. So to
summarize: a good premise is....? And a bad
premise is...? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:57 am Storygeeks But...
situations make lots of money :) So, i have no judgements about
weak stories...question is what do you want to do? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:57 am hayphoto_ca @Storygeeks so
mainly to build a good story you need a lot in the
character development, mainly plot of moral choices. #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:57 am Storygeeks Be
conscious abouyt what you are writing... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:58 am Al_1701 @wcmartell Which is
why I write science fiction and fantasy. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:58 am LaurieAshbourne RT @Storygeeks:
@sarahalexis4 if you have a protag with a moral
problem then you have a story not a situation (ala
Cloverfield) #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:58 am Storygeeks @ericnjones: a good
premise is your story's structure revealed in one
sentence (very hard to do) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:58 am hayphoto_ca @wcmartell I've
seen so many pre-screenings recently, pay? But
yeah I'm going to write what I want to make into a movie
#scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:58 am Storygeeks @ericnjones... a bad
premise IS BORING #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:58 am Storygeeks @Al_1701... HA...
love that #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:58 am hayphoto_ca So far a
lot of people dieing... RT @Storygeeks: Be conscious abouyt
what you are writing... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:59 am Jamie_LD @wcmartell I say,
write what you want to read 20-30 times without
getting bored. Wait, is that possible? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:59 am Storygeeks Thank
you all.. pls vist http://t.co/um3NWv3e and like me on
Facebook http://t.co/antr8g4X... :))) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:59 am DannyManus @ericnjones A good
premise is relatable, yet completely imaginative
& opens up many diff directions for story
&characters #scriptchat
2013-02-18 1:59 am zacsanford2 I wanted
to thank @storygeeks for being our guest tonight. The
transcript should be posted sometime later tonight or
tomorrow. #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:00 am ericnjones RT @Storygeeks:
@ericnjones: a good premise is your story's
structure revealed in one sentence (very hard to do) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:00 am ericnjones RT @Storygeeks:
@ericnjones... a bad premise IS BORING #
scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:00 am wcmartell Pardon
my plug: Only a few days old and #4 on Amazon's
Screenwriting list: Act Two Blue Book. http://t.co/CdafKrON
Over 200
pgs #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:00 am Storygeeks Keep an
eye out for my premise workshop here in LA... I teach it a lot
at Writers Store and Writers JUnction... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:00 am Jamie_LD RT @wcmartell:
Only a few days old and #4 on Amazon's
Screenwriting list: Act Two Blue Book. http://t.co/pt7ANiJf
Over 200
pgs #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:00 am hayphoto_ca @zacsanford2 @storygeeks thanks
for running this! #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:00 am GoIntoTheStory Screenwriting
News: February 11-February 17, 2013
http://t.co/UDYTcguT #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:00 am ChipNotDonald @Storygeeks Thanks
for coming out tonight! An interesting #
scriptchat.
2013-02-18 2:01 am Storygeeks Thank
you scriptchat US for the opportunity :) #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:01 am art1032 Thank
you @storygeeks and #scriptchat great
chat as always:)
2013-02-18 2:02 am Al_1701 @Storygeeks Any way
to connect online? #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:02 am mantralarcenist “The
purpose of a writer is to keep civilization from destroying itself.” -
Camus. No pressure then... #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:02 am ericnjones RT @DannyManus:
@ericnjones A good premise is relatable, yet
completely imaginative & opens up many diff
directions for story
&characters #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:02 am hayphoto_ca Well we
shall see what I end up making next, film-making is always
fun when a character emerges and story is born #scriptchat
2013-02-18 2:02 am Jamie_LD @Storygeeks Thanks
for chatting with us about testing your idea! #
scriptchat
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